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Mark Pereira

Page history last edited by Mark P 14 years, 10 months ago

 

What is humanly possible? Is there anything we as people cannot do?

 

In a similar thread to last time, we can do many things, but some of the things we do can only be done through mechanical aids. Once again, this begs the question: Does this disqualify our actions as our own? Zubair says yes, they are no longer valid, since it is not we who are doing anything at that point. What do you think?

 

Also, from our recent discussions: St. Augustine said that the only thing we can do is to act as God, to be as perfect and virtuous as possible.

But as we all know that we, as people are imperfect. So does that mean that that we cannot do as St. Augustine says, or that it is even more desireable?

 

Also from a brief, non-verbal conversation: We as people cannot judge who goes to Heaven or Hell (or appropriate equivalents). That is left to (the) God(s).

Taking  a step back...

Lets see if any philosophers' ideals apply to my question. In my topic, people's actions aren't really are, nor are they becoming,unless you say they are becoming an actuality, in which case they are in fact both. People's actions, while they exist in the person's imagination, simply are. As the person acts, the action forms an ideal, and becomes reality.

But this has very little to do with what we as people can do. Therefore Heraclitus, Paramenides, Democritus, and Empedocles are not really applicable.

However, there may be philosophical theories that apply to my question, in terms of ethics and views. See What should we do?.

 

SO from above, if machines disqualify our actions, there is quite a lot we cannot do(!). But what should we define as mechanical aid? Simply a knife or plow as technology, or an entire airplane? 

 

For now, I will say the that machines and technology do not disqualify our actions, as they are merely an extension of ourselves. - Addendum: Descartes says that humans are the "perfect machine", taking much influence from the mechanistic world view endowed by the Baroque period. So we could simply be creating simple beings, (insofar) void of thought, who are better suited at doing tasks that we would like completed.

 

Here we are left with one option. If we can do anything, (besides that ordained by God) what should we do?

Well, here I can apply philosphical mindsets, such as the epicureans, the nihilists, and the mystics.

Epicureans - They would think that the only things we should do are those  concerned with our own satisfaction and pleasure.

Stoics - They woud think that we should not really do anything in terms of resistance, only to persevere and endure anything that comes their way.

Nihilists - would say that we can do anything, a there is no way to prove that anything is wrong. And there is no reason other wise to not do so.

Cynics - would think much like the epicureans, except that they would do things that do not neccessarily have to do with any material objects.

Neoplationists - Care more about the nature of God and the world. It is rather vague.

Mystics - They would also attempt to reach God, by living a life of purity and self-sacrifice, of virtue.

 

On another note, are we simply acting under God's will? Do we have any choice in what we do? Is there such a thing as Fate? (separate question/philosphical ties)

I'll say that we do have free will. The existence of free will is possible and likely, while fate can neiother be proven nor disproven. If fate does exist, then every action we do is preordained, and so are our thoughts then. Even our decisions to defy fate (if you can really call it that) are pre-decided, and are actually fruitless in nature. Also, if fate does exist, then there is no consequence for our actions, since it is "destiny" and punishing or rewarding what would have happened anyway is somewhat useless. Unless the consequence is fated. AGH.

Like I said, fate can not be proven or disproven.

 

"He who knows right, does right." - Socrates

Socrates believed that  anyone who has knowledge of the good or the correct, will act accordingly.

But of course, we humans are creatures of circumstance, and our actions, be they wrong or right (as based on society's values and morals), are based largely on the situation, and a person who knows "right" may not always act so.

For we have eaten of the Apple of Knowdege of Good and Evil, and we therefore know right and wrong. As such, we can act both rightly and wrongly. If we're taking a biblical approach to things.

 

Kant mentioned certain "forms of intuition" that govern how we percieve the world around us. Think jugs. It is my belief that these same defining structures (i.e. time and space)  also define our actions. for what are they but the manifestation of our thoughts? As such, we can only do what is defined by time and space, along with physical properties of matter.

So we can't stick our hand through walls (without destroying them), travel backwards through time, exist in two places at once, or substitute for a car engine when the need arises, or survive in temperatures in excess of 50 degrees celsius.

 

ISU Dialogue: HERE

Comments (18)

Jennifer said

at 12:19 am on Feb 12, 2009

why is infinity inconceivable? what do you mean by solid concept?

Mark P said

at 5:47 pm on Feb 12, 2009

I mean the solid concept as opposed to the abstract concept. Because you deal with the abstract concept of infinity in math quite often, but you never actually come across something which is infinite, and if you do, you naturally apply boundaries to it so as to be able to comprehend it, e.g. space.

Joe Lord-Annis said

at 1:17 pm on Feb 12, 2009

It depends what you consider perceivable, as well. If you consider that anything using the five senses is perceotion, that is different than considering what we can perceive using other such things.(computers, etc.) or if you also include things that we perceive by association, for example, we knew that bats had very little ability for sight, however they knew where they were going, therefor we knew about echolocation through association with bats, not through our actual perceptability. more to come.

JO37 said

at 5:33 pm on Feb 12, 2009

Who's to say what our senses tell are reality or truth. Say what we see is reality, could there be a sight chance, just the slightest, that there is another reality? Take an after-life for example, how can it be some people swear they can see, hear and smell ghosts or phantoms? I say, there's more then one reality

Jennifer said

at 9:24 pm on Feb 12, 2009

Why is it that boundaries are put for comprehension? Isn't it more so for functionality? And if I never come across something that is infinite, that doesn't mean I come across something that is finite. The concept of finite is only a contextual in terms of space, so to say that it's empirical or that it's there because we "feel it" is wrong. The concepts of infinite as well as finite are there because we make a judgement, precisely a measurement, to a specific area.

I would say that reality COULD BE considered what can be sensed or tested for existence (our human capabilities are obviously limited, so maybe you could expand on the concept of perception by a machine), but there is a difference as to "what's there" and the "evaluation of what's there".

I hope I make sense.

Mark P said

at 5:05 pm on Feb 17, 2009

Perhaps these boundaries you have only help you comprehend what is around you. We should continue what we talked about in math class today. It was noteworthy.

I will expand on mechanical perception.

Joe Lord-Annis said

at 12:44 pm on Feb 17, 2009

The Senses!?!

sebastien said

at 1:37 pm on Feb 17, 2009

when we dream, sometimes it feels so real. maybe life is just a big dream that we have labelled as reality

sebastien said

at 1:37 pm on Feb 17, 2009

when we dream, sometimes it feels so real. maybe life is just a big dream that we have labelled as reality

Joe Lord-Annis said

at 1:31 am on Feb 24, 2009

Haha, looks like our questions are inexplicably linked, eh, mark? Maybe, just maybe, dreams ARE real. and we just think they aren't, or they are symbolic. Do dreams help to define reality? Or make it harder? I guess if you write them off as fiction and nothing more, then they do neither, but more likely they mean something. Is that something real? we perceive it, but often don't rationalize it. then again, it is in our brain, the source of rational activity, and not in the outside world, the source of the senses. Are dreams real through a Parmedian perspective, A Hericlitean perspective, both? Maybe it doesn't even matter.

Joe Lord-Annis said

at 11:02 pm on Apr 5, 2009

Perception defines reality, the senses are everything.

Joe Lord-Annis said

at 11:02 pm on Apr 5, 2009

Thoughts define Reality, Reason is everything.

Mark P said

at 12:45 pm on Apr 17, 2009

<i>HTML test</i>

Mark P said

at 12:45 pm on Apr 17, 2009

Ha, fail.

Zubie said

at 3:33 pm on Apr 26, 2009

Hey mark, so why is "Zubair" in your introduction? i am just wondering =)

Mark P said

at 3:15 pm on Apr 27, 2009

Because Sara, we spoke on my topic two Fridays ago, and provided some counterpoints to my own arguments/thoughts. They proved helpful, so I though I'd give you some credit. Your name's underlined because most direct personal pronouns are, if you'll note. Thanks!

Zubie said

at 8:52 pm on Apr 27, 2009

umm... ok! I am gald to have been helpful!

Greg said

at 12:29 pm on May 1, 2009

we can't swallow our own head

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